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	<title>Comments on: Court eases retaliation proof requirement</title>
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	<description>The Supreme Court of the United States blog</description>
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		<title>By: Commentator</title>
		<link>http://www.scotusblog.com/2006/06/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9945</link>
		<dc:creator>Commentator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jun 2006 19:45:55 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Actually, I don&#039;t substantively disagree with Alito&#039;s concurrence. Were Congress to pass the statute that Alito drafted in his concurrence I&#039;d have little problem with it. But I think Alito&#039;s rewriting of the statute is activist because it is clearly an unwarranted act. Congressional intent as reflected in the statute is clear. Furthermore, Alito&#039;s vaunted craftmanship is nowhere to be found; his concurrence is very clumsily. A more artfully drafted opinion in a closer case, i.e., one where the statute were not obviously inconsistent with Alito&#039;s interpretation, might earn my support. But no amount ideology would take me this far. Alito&#039;s concurrence is nothing but polemical dicta screeching at Congress to amend its law.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, I don&#8217;t substantively disagree with Alito&#8217;s concurrence. Were Congress to pass the statute that Alito drafted in his concurrence I&#8217;d have little problem with it. But I think Alito&#8217;s rewriting of the statute is activist because it is clearly an unwarranted act. Congressional intent as reflected in the statute is clear. Furthermore, Alito&#8217;s vaunted craftmanship is nowhere to be found; his concurrence is very clumsily. A more artfully drafted opinion in a closer case, i.e., one where the statute were not obviously inconsistent with Alito&#8217;s interpretation, might earn my support. But no amount ideology would take me this far. Alito&#8217;s concurrence is nothing but polemical dicta screeching at Congress to amend its law.</p>
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		<title>By: td1976</title>
		<link>http://www.scotusblog.com/2006/06/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9944</link>
		<dc:creator>td1976</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jun 2006 19:05:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scotusblog.com/wp/uncategorized/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9944</guid>
		<description>And so long as you consider it &quot;judging&quot; whether it&#039;s a &quot;conservative&quot; or &quot;liberal&quot; judge writing it, I&#039;d agree.  Activism is code-speak for substantive disagreement with court decisions; very often the first to cry &quot;activism&quot; over a liberal or moderate judge&#039;s mention of policy is dead silent when a conservative judge like Alito does the same thing.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And so long as you consider it &#8220;judging&#8221; whether it&#8217;s a &#8220;conservative&#8221; or &#8220;liberal&#8221; judge writing it, I&#8217;d agree.  Activism is code-speak for substantive disagreement with court decisions; very often the first to cry &#8220;activism&#8221; over a liberal or moderate judge&#8217;s mention of policy is dead silent when a conservative judge like Alito does the same thing.</p>
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		<title>By: madisonian</title>
		<link>http://www.scotusblog.com/2006/06/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9943</link>
		<dc:creator>madisonian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jun 2006 17:42:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scotusblog.com/wp/uncategorized/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9943</guid>
		<description>*** Do you have a cite for the proposition that plaintiff wanted all acts, no matter how trivial or petty, to count for retaliation?***
I haven&#039;t read the respondent&#039;s brief, but according to Justice Alito (p.2), respondent &quot;staunchly defends&quot; the view that the term &quot;discriminate&quot; in Title VII&#039;s retaliation provision should be read literally to cover any form of differential treatment.  Both the Court and the concurring opinion quite properly reject that unbounded intepretation.  But, in so doing, both opinions are necessarily construing an ambiguous statute to reach the result most consistent with their understanding of congressional intent and, yes, sound policy.  You can call this activism if you like, but I would prefer to call it judging.  It&#039;s what courts are supposed to do.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>*** Do you have a cite for the proposition that plaintiff wanted all acts, no matter how trivial or petty, to count for retaliation?***</p>
<p>I haven&#8217;t read the respondent&#8217;s brief, but according to Justice Alito (p.2), respondent &#8220;staunchly defends&#8221; the view that the term &#8220;discriminate&#8221; in Title VII&#8217;s retaliation provision should be read literally to cover any form of differential treatment.  Both the Court and the concurring opinion quite properly reject that unbounded intepretation.  But, in so doing, both opinions are necessarily construing an ambiguous statute to reach the result most consistent with their understanding of congressional intent and, yes, sound policy.  You can call this activism if you like, but I would prefer to call it judging.  It&#8217;s what courts are supposed to do.</p>
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		<title>By: td1976</title>
		<link>http://www.scotusblog.com/2006/06/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9942</link>
		<dc:creator>td1976</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jun 2006 15:09:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scotusblog.com/wp/uncategorized/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9942</guid>
		<description>The plaintiff took the position of the EEOC, found in its compliance manual, that the anti-retaliation law &quot;prohibit[s] any discrimination that is reasonably likely to deter protected activity.&quot; EEOC Compl. Man. Â§ 8-II.D.3.  The &quot;cold shoulder&quot; is absolutely NOT reasonably likely to deter protected activity, and this is exactly what SCOTUS said in its opinion.&lt;p&gt;Do you have a cite for the proposition that plaintiff wanted all acts, no matter how trivial or petty, to count for retaliation?  You&#039;re creating a strawman for ideological purposes.  It might be more convincing if you didn&#039;t exaggerate what&#039;s really going on.  The statutory language of the anti-retaliation provision prohibits discrimination, period, unlike the immediately-preceeding anti-discrimination provision which prohibits only discrimination in the terms and conditions of employment.  Even a layman could see that the retaliation provision is not limited in the way you favor.&lt;p&gt;The Court--admirably joined by Scalia and Thomas, showing that their commitment to plain-text reading does not extend only to the extent it coincides with their policy preferences--followed the law as written.  The Congress is the proper body to limit the retaliation law, not the Court.  Alito&#039;s opinion shows that he thinks he can rewrite *a statute* to suit his idea of what proper public policy would be.  He admits as such.  That&#039;s activism.  &lt;/p&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The plaintiff took the position of the EEOC, found in its compliance manual, that the anti-retaliation law &#8220;prohibit[s] any discrimination that is reasonably likely to deter protected activity.&#8221; EEOC Compl. Man. Â§ 8-II.D.3.  The &#8220;cold shoulder&#8221; is absolutely NOT reasonably likely to deter protected activity, and this is exactly what SCOTUS said in its opinion.
<p>Do you have a cite for the proposition that plaintiff wanted all acts, no matter how trivial or petty, to count for retaliation?  You&#8217;re creating a strawman for ideological purposes.  It might be more convincing if you didn&#8217;t exaggerate what&#8217;s really going on.  The statutory language of the anti-retaliation provision prohibits discrimination, period, unlike the immediately-preceeding anti-discrimination provision which prohibits only discrimination in the terms and conditions of employment.  Even a layman could see that the retaliation provision is not limited in the way you favor.</p>
<p>The Court&#8211;admirably joined by Scalia and Thomas, showing that their commitment to plain-text reading does not extend only to the extent it coincides with their policy preferences&#8211;followed the law as written.  The Congress is the proper body to limit the retaliation law, not the Court.  Alito&#8217;s opinion shows that he thinks he can rewrite *a statute* to suit his idea of what proper public policy would be.  He admits as such.  That&#8217;s activism.  </p>
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		<title>By: Hans Bader</title>
		<link>http://www.scotusblog.com/2006/06/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9941</link>
		<dc:creator>Hans Bader</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jun 2006 14:50:21 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Yes, I did read the opinion in the Burlington Northern Title VII case, which construed the reach of Title VII&#039;s retaliation provisions quite expansively.
I wasn&#039;t relying on the canon of constitutional doubts to criticize the majority&#039;s interpretation of Title VII&#039;s retaliation provision.
I was relying on it to reject the even more expansive interpretation of Title VII&#039;s retaliation provision advocated by the plaintiff, under which just giving a plaintiff a could shoulder might well constitute &quot;retaliation.&quot;
The plaintiff might well prove retaliation even under my more limited reading of Title VII&#039;s retaliation provision.  (Even Justice Alito&#039;s concurrence, which adopted a more limited reading of Title VII&#039;s retaliation provision than the majority, concluded that the plaintiff in Burlington Northern might be able to prove retaliation).
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, I did read the opinion in the Burlington Northern Title VII case, which construed the reach of Title VII&#8217;s retaliation provisions quite expansively.</p>
<p>I wasn&#8217;t relying on the canon of constitutional doubts to criticize the majority&#8217;s interpretation of Title VII&#8217;s retaliation provision.</p>
<p>I was relying on it to reject the even more expansive interpretation of Title VII&#8217;s retaliation provision advocated by the plaintiff, under which just giving a plaintiff a could shoulder might well constitute &#8220;retaliation.&#8221;</p>
<p>The plaintiff might well prove retaliation even under my more limited reading of Title VII&#8217;s retaliation provision.  (Even Justice Alito&#8217;s concurrence, which adopted a more limited reading of Title VII&#8217;s retaliation provision than the majority, concluded that the plaintiff in Burlington Northern might be able to prove retaliation).</p>
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		<title>By: td1976</title>
		<link>http://www.scotusblog.com/2006/06/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9940</link>
		<dc:creator>td1976</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jun 2006 13:29:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scotusblog.com/wp/uncategorized/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9940</guid>
		<description>Hans, again, give me a break.  Did you actually read the opinion?  It doesn&#039;t allow for retaliation suits based on an accused harasser&#039;s &quot;taking umbrage, &quot;publicly defending himself&quot; or other such nonsense.  It expressly does not allow retaliation suits for &quot;any negative response by the accused&quot; or that &quot;all adverse commentary&quot; is retaliation.
&lt;p&gt;
In fact, the opinion does the opposite.  It specifically states that things like &quot;the cold shoulder&quot; are not materially adverse and do not count as retaliation.
&lt;p&gt;
Furthermore, the &quot;constitutional doubt&quot; question has absolutely no applicability on these facts.  The woman was kicked off a more prestigious job and suspended without pay because she complained about harassment.  No speech issues there.
&lt;p&gt;If some court were faced with speech-related retaliation, the statute might be interpreted as excluding pure-speech based retaliatory acts so as to save the constitutionality of the statute.  &lt;i&gt;Cf. Noviello v. City of Boston&lt;/i&gt;, 398 F.3d 76 (1st Cir. 2005) (excluding from consideration evideidence of allegedly retaliatory act that was pure speech supporting accused harasser).   But it doesn&#039;t favor the meat-cleaver approach you put forth, in removing protection for the countless acts of non-speech related retailiation because it&#039;s possible that a speech-related claim might be brought someday.  &lt;/p&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hans, again, give me a break.  Did you actually read the opinion?  It doesn&#8217;t allow for retaliation suits based on an accused harasser&#8217;s &#8220;taking umbrage, &#8220;publicly defending himself&#8221; or other such nonsense.  It expressly does not allow retaliation suits for &#8220;any negative response by the accused&#8221; or that &#8220;all adverse commentary&#8221; is retaliation.</p>
<p>
In fact, the opinion does the opposite.  It specifically states that things like &#8220;the cold shoulder&#8221; are not materially adverse and do not count as retaliation.
</p>
<p>
Furthermore, the &#8220;constitutional doubt&#8221; question has absolutely no applicability on these facts.  The woman was kicked off a more prestigious job and suspended without pay because she complained about harassment.  No speech issues there.
</p>
<p>If some court were faced with speech-related retaliation, the statute might be interpreted as excluding pure-speech based retaliatory acts so as to save the constitutionality of the statute.  <i>Cf. Noviello v. City of Boston</i>, 398 F.3d 76 (1st Cir. 2005) (excluding from consideration evideidence of allegedly retaliatory act that was pure speech supporting accused harasser).   But it doesn&#8217;t favor the meat-cleaver approach you put forth, in removing protection for the countless acts of non-speech related retailiation because it&#8217;s possible that a speech-related claim might be brought someday.  </p>
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		<title>By: Commentator</title>
		<link>http://www.scotusblog.com/2006/06/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9939</link>
		<dc:creator>Commentator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jun 2006 05:27:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scotusblog.com/wp/uncategorized/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9939</guid>
		<description>Actually, Congress can&#039;t fix its own mess if every time it re-writes a statute, an activist judge underinterprets it as if it has no impact on reality. And, the concern of 8 members of the Court was that there would be too few suits, not too many. The greater the number of potential suits, the greater the deterrent effect. Alito was trying to dampen the real-world impact of the statute. He was interfering with Congressional intent, not furthering it. That is not fidelity to anything but blind ideology.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, Congress can&#8217;t fix its own mess if every time it re-writes a statute, an activist judge underinterprets it as if it has no impact on reality. And, the concern of 8 members of the Court was that there would be too few suits, not too many. The greater the number of potential suits, the greater the deterrent effect. Alito was trying to dampen the real-world impact of the statute. He was interfering with Congressional intent, not furthering it. That is not fidelity to anything but blind ideology.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel</title>
		<link>http://www.scotusblog.com/2006/06/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9938</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jun 2006 01:27:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scotusblog.com/wp/uncategorized/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9938</guid>
		<description>I applaud the SC on the Title VII case.  One thing I think that lawyers forget is what the day to day working world is like.  It is nothing like a law firm, for sure.  As Justice Holmes perfectly noted, law is not simply a logical exercise; it is an exercise informed by the experiences of people of good sense.
The fundamental fact is that Title VII is not about protecting workers at all.  It is about protecting good managers from bad managers.  It is a tool of management, by management, for management.  Anyone involved in EEO law understands this as a matter of experience.  The idea about managers being human is utter nonsense.  They are getting paid to be managers, not to be human beings.  If a wanted a human being as a manager, I would get joe dumddumb off the street and pay him $5 an hour.  Managers are supposed to be better than their employees; if not, they have no call to hold the additional power and responsibility that being a manager requires.
The current ruling is a good ruling because it realizes that since most of the formal tools have already been taken away from poor managers, they have now resorted to informal ones.  But formal or informal, the net result is the same: an atmosphere of fear.  This, as any intelligent manager knows, is not the atmosphere that rings in the dollars, at least not in a economic system that condemns outright slavery.
As a former business manager I applaud this ruling.  It is good for business and good for America.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I applaud the SC on the Title VII case.  One thing I think that lawyers forget is what the day to day working world is like.  It is nothing like a law firm, for sure.  As Justice Holmes perfectly noted, law is not simply a logical exercise; it is an exercise informed by the experiences of people of good sense.</p>
<p>The fundamental fact is that Title VII is not about protecting workers at all.  It is about protecting good managers from bad managers.  It is a tool of management, by management, for management.  Anyone involved in EEO law understands this as a matter of experience.  The idea about managers being human is utter nonsense.  They are getting paid to be managers, not to be human beings.  If a wanted a human being as a manager, I would get joe dumddumb off the street and pay him $5 an hour.  Managers are supposed to be better than their employees; if not, they have no call to hold the additional power and responsibility that being a manager requires.</p>
<p>The current ruling is a good ruling because it realizes that since most of the formal tools have already been taken away from poor managers, they have now resorted to informal ones.  But formal or informal, the net result is the same: an atmosphere of fear.  This, as any intelligent manager knows, is not the atmosphere that rings in the dollars, at least not in a economic system that condemns outright slavery.</p>
<p>As a former business manager I applaud this ruling.  It is good for business and good for America.</p>
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		<title>By: Hans Bader</title>
		<link>http://www.scotusblog.com/2006/06/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9937</link>
		<dc:creator>Hans Bader</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jun 2006 00:52:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scotusblog.com/wp/uncategorized/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9937</guid>
		<description>The canon of constitutional doubts also counsels in favor of an limited interpretation of what constitutes retaliation under Title VII.
As Judges Kozinski and Kleinfeld of the Ninth Circuit, and Justice Charles Fried of the Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court, have observed, allowing any negative response by the accused to charges of discrimination to be classified as retaliation raises serious First Amendment issues.
If a complainant accuses someone of discrimination or harassment based on thinly grounded claims, the complainant should not be surprised when the accused takes umbrage, and should not expect the accused not to publicly defend him or herself or not to limit future interaction with the complainant.
Setting the bar low to what constitutes &quot;retaliation&quot; (treating all adverse commentary as retaliation) opens the door to retaliation claims based on consitutionally protected speech by the accused defending himself or herself, under the theory that such speech in opposition dissuades the complainant from bringing charges of discrimination.  See, e.g., Bain v. City of Springfield.
That&#039;s another reason to define retaliation more narrowly as Justice Alito does in his concurrence.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The canon of constitutional doubts also counsels in favor of an limited interpretation of what constitutes retaliation under Title VII.</p>
<p>As Judges Kozinski and Kleinfeld of the Ninth Circuit, and Justice Charles Fried of the Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court, have observed, allowing any negative response by the accused to charges of discrimination to be classified as retaliation raises serious First Amendment issues.</p>
<p>If a complainant accuses someone of discrimination or harassment based on thinly grounded claims, the complainant should not be surprised when the accused takes umbrage, and should not expect the accused not to publicly defend him or herself or not to limit future interaction with the complainant.</p>
<p>Setting the bar low to what constitutes &#8220;retaliation&#8221; (treating all adverse commentary as retaliation) opens the door to retaliation claims based on consitutionally protected speech by the accused defending himself or herself, under the theory that such speech in opposition dissuades the complainant from bringing charges of discrimination.  See, e.g., Bain v. City of Springfield.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s another reason to define retaliation more narrowly as Justice Alito does in his concurrence.</p>
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		<title>By: Marc Shepherd</title>
		<link>http://www.scotusblog.com/2006/06/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9936</link>
		<dc:creator>Marc Shepherd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jun 2006 22:44:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scotusblog.com/wp/uncategorized/court-eases-retaliation-proof-requirement/#comment-9936</guid>
		<description>Stephen Purdy speculated that in LabCorp v. Metabolite, &quot;is it possible that one justice could have bolted from Justice Breyer&#039;s camp in order to avoid a 4-4 split, thus creating the creating the 5-3 majority for the DIG order?&quot;
Well, a 4-4 split and a DIG have the identical practical effects: the decision below remains in place, but the action has no precedential value. However, a 4-4 split usually produces nothing more than a one-sentence order, while DIGs sometimes do produce concurrences and/or dissents. Breyer&#039;s dissent suggested that some justices saw procedural or jurisdictional obstacles that would prevent them from reaching the merits.
It&#039;s a pity this case didn&#039;t produce a reversal, as there&#039;s a pretty good argument that the Federal Circuit got it wrong.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Stephen Purdy speculated that in LabCorp v. Metabolite, &#8220;is it possible that one justice could have bolted from Justice Breyer&#8217;s camp in order to avoid a 4-4 split, thus creating the creating the 5-3 majority for the DIG order?&#8221;</p>
<p>Well, a 4-4 split and a DIG have the identical practical effects: the decision below remains in place, but the action has no precedential value. However, a 4-4 split usually produces nothing more than a one-sentence order, while DIGs sometimes do produce concurrences and/or dissents. Breyer&#8217;s dissent suggested that some justices saw procedural or jurisdictional obstacles that would prevent them from reaching the merits.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a pity this case didn&#8217;t produce a reversal, as there&#8217;s a pretty good argument that the Federal Circuit got it wrong.</p>
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